I've been told that I'm a panther. I don't know what that says about me though.
"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr
Bona Dea
JoinedPosts by Bona Dea
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79
What is your Totem Animal?
by Hyghlandyr ina lot of you might think this is a question strictly for the pagans out there, but christians have had totem animals as well.
merriam-websters defines a totem as:main entry: totem .
pronunciation: 'to-t&m.
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Bona Dea
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Is Anyone a Pantheist ?
by LucidSky inis anyone a pantheist ?.
in my search for the meaning of life, it has been only a month or two since i've actually become agnostic.
my reason for the final rejection of christianity was that i could not believe a god of love, justice and wisdom would create a world that along with life/pleasure would also foster death/suffering for seemingly infinite numbers of innocent and not-so-innocent beings.
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Bona Dea
I have read into Pantheism before. As a matter of fact, it was that exact same site from which I had gotten most of my info. I find myself in a place not very unlike where you are now, although I have not progressed to the point of actually calling myself agnostic. I suppose I'm just not ready to let go. I think that fear is why many people, even when shown evidence and logical reasonings as to why the bible must at least have "errors" and that God (as described in the bible) is not perfect nor just, they just can't accept it. Fear of death (real death without any return), Fear of eternal torment or of being annihilated, Fear of missing out on the paradise or heaven, Fear of accepting that this is it....
I used to think that Atheists were atheist simply so that they didn't have to accept any punishment for having lack of morals (I'm not saying that Atheists are immoral...I'm saying if they wanted to be then there was no "eternal" punishment for it). They could do pretty much anything they wanted and there was no reward nor any punishment for it in the afterlife. That by giving up belief in God had made their lives easier. But I have learned that being (or at least becoming) an Atheist and losing faith in something that you have known your whole life is not easy or fun at all. Accepting the fact that no, there is no heaven afterwards, no "paradise earth"...no great reward. This is it. And then you rot. I mean, who really wants to believe that? I feel like this is why many cling to God.
In reality, it seems as if mankind invented the devil so that they wouldn't have to accept responsibility for their own bad deeds and they invented God so they wouldn't have the responsibility of fixing things or trying to make things right either. "Just wait til God comes and he'll make everything right again"...."Things are they way they are because Satan is in control of this system things"
And to add insult to injury, the JWs throw in this belief that man can never "make things right" no matter what we do. In fact, that is what this whole thing called life is about...God's letting man see for himself that he can do nothing right without God's help. What kind of "father" would do that? Here ya go son, ride this bike but know that I am (pardon the pun) the training wheels and without them you will fall. Seems kind of twisted, doesn't it?
Just my 2 cents. Great thread.
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Jesus was a False Prophet
by JosephAlward inas he sat upon mount of olives, jesus was telling his disciples about the end of the world and what they could expect just before that apocalyptic event.
they asked him, .
"when shall these things be?
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Bona Dea
Thanks plmkrzy! Is that short for plum krazy?
"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr -
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A little Hobbit humor.....
by closer2fine inhttp://www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit/default.asp .
closer .
solid stone is just sand and water, baby.
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Bona Dea
Tigerlily Bramble of Willowbottom
That was too cute!!
"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr -
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Changes in Baptism vows again?????
by Jang inis paragraph 11 on page 12 of the april 1 watchtower an indication that candidates will no longer be baptised in the name of the organization any longer?.
jang.
caic website: http://caic.org.au/.
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Bona Dea
Great observation, Nemesis! ...And here I was thinking that the elder with whom I've been studying (the past several years) was just genuinely concerned with my making such a serious commitment (I've never been baptized but had seriously considered it at one point)...when in reality he was probably thinking that I didn't meet society "qualifications". Thank God for that !!!
"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr -
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Do the Witnesses "manipulate" recruits?
by refiners fire indo they "mystically manipulate"people joining them?.
im inclined to say they dont.. they are almost unique in this.. practically every cult ive joined, i could recite a litany of manipulation techniques applied to me during my joining process.. the dubs study with people, systematically, unemotionally.. noone else does this in my experience.. people who join the dubs join under "intellectual conviction".. do you agree with this view or not??.
im most curious to hear opinions on this.
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Bona Dea
Hi Darkhorse,
No, I was never baptised. Luckily I woke up, so to speak, before I made that plunge.
I became involved with the witnesses for several reasons. One thing was curiosity. I live in the bible belt of the South. Growing up, I was strongly advised to stay away from JWs. So, I guess curiosity killed the cat. I had to open my door to these people, if for no other reason than to know why everyone steered clear of them. Another thing, was that I had a bad experience with a church that I had attended for about 10 years. I was a little (sarcasm) bitter against the church and in time, in my own mind, I somehow had managed to lump all church people into this one category...narrow-minded, hypocrites. The witnesses really couldn't have picked a better time to knock on my door.
I apologize for the sarcasm to RF. It's just I'm still involved with the witnesses because, unfortunately, my husband doesn't share the same p-o-v as I do concerning the Borg. He is very into it. So, this is still a very fresh and real thing to me and not something I'm remembering from a long ago past.
I wish you the best with your friend. I do hope you can help her.
"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr -
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Colorgenics
by peaceloveharmony inclick the link :).
http://colorgenics.com/.
a good friend is someone who will come and bail you out of jail, but a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "that was f**king awesome.
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Bona Dea
LOL @ detective.
"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr -
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Do the Witnesses "manipulate" recruits?
by refiners fire indo they "mystically manipulate"people joining them?.
im inclined to say they dont.. they are almost unique in this.. practically every cult ive joined, i could recite a litany of manipulation techniques applied to me during my joining process.. the dubs study with people, systematically, unemotionally.. noone else does this in my experience.. people who join the dubs join under "intellectual conviction".. do you agree with this view or not??.
im most curious to hear opinions on this.
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Bona Dea
Gee, RF....thanks for the kind "welcome to our forum".
I'm sorry...are you a psychologist? I didn't realize that I was dealing with a gen-U-ine "expert" here. So, you have diagnosed me as having been "manuevered"??? This is YOUR expert opinion???? Wow, I feel so much better now. Now, I KNOW for sure that I was manipulated...because YOU said so![8>]
I'm glad that I could actually teach you something and you got a good laugh from my experience.
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Do the Witnesses "manipulate" recruits?
by refiners fire indo they "mystically manipulate"people joining them?.
im inclined to say they dont.. they are almost unique in this.. practically every cult ive joined, i could recite a litany of manipulation techniques applied to me during my joining process.. the dubs study with people, systematically, unemotionally.. noone else does this in my experience.. people who join the dubs join under "intellectual conviction".. do you agree with this view or not??.
im most curious to hear opinions on this.
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Bona Dea
Genuine, critical, open intellectual discussion and examination is not permitted. If a Bible Study turns up with ex-JW literature, or literature of non-JW critiques, or makes arguments about the JW history, and asks to look at older literature, the Elders will be asked to get involved, and they will make every attempt to move the Study back into an exclusive review of current JW literature ...
I never had this problem during our bible studys. However, I never printed out x or non jw material but rather rattled off things I had read (such as the pyramid thing, the miracle wheat, numerous predictions) and they never backed down. These things were, of course, explained by the "new light" and "imperfect men" speeches (and in reality, ANYTHING can be explained away by using those two explanations). I think that is what drew me in; is the fact that they "seemed" to have an explanation for everything.
But I do agree with the comments...they do slowly and subtly draw you in. You don't even really realize it is happening until it has already happened.
I can remember reading an article that they had brought to me about saying "bless you" and "good luck". I had never thought of things the way the articles had presented them. Over a period of time, I began to feel guilty when I said these things...like I might actually be offending God or something. Eventually, I made a conscious effort to quit saying them altogether.
I also had a picture of Christ nailed to the cross (an antique) hanging on my wall. Even after we had covered the whole cross/stake thing...and I had became convinced through our thorough research of scripture (of course, with the aide of their bible based publications ), that Jesus had indeed died on a stake and not a cross...the picture remained on my wall. One day while studying, a subtle comment was dropped. The conversation went something like...
jw's: "if I have some candles with snowmen and snowflakes on them, decorating my home in the winter...granted it doesn't really mean I believe in celebrating Christmas...BUT what would someone else think if they came into my home and saw them?"
Their eyes then moved to my picture on the wall. I laughed and said,
me: "Well I suppose I should take that down. I'm just so attached to it. I never really thought about it that way..."Then some little remark was made like..."we're not telling you what to do...just something to think about." Then the seed was planted. The picture, of course, came down. I mean, if I was really a good christian I definitely wouldn't want to stumble someone by keeping this picture on my wall...
While I don't believe they force anything on anyone, I think it would be naive to say that they aren't "at the very least" manipulative.
just my 2 cents
...edited because I'm a doofus
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32
Jesus was a False Prophet
by JosephAlward inas he sat upon mount of olives, jesus was telling his disciples about the end of the world and what they could expect just before that apocalyptic event.
they asked him, .
"when shall these things be?
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Bona Dea
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"Half the world is composed of idiots, the other half of people clever enough to take indecent advantage of them."
-Walter Kerr